User talk:Verdy p

Update request

Hello.

In Module:Countries/Europe/Template:Countries of Europe, can you remove Gagauzia, which is a region in Moldova? It is not a breakaway state nor does it have a special status.

Yours sincerely, Orattas (talk) 12:58, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

Sorry, there's an edit war currently ongoing with various people. This should be discussed, I won't participate to the discussion about the "limited recognition" status, possibly historic (before 1994?), which has various pages and related contents discussing it already. I did not add it myself. Go to the community talk pages in case of problems to reach a consensus. verdy_p (talk) 15:16, 29 January 2025 (UTC)
I understand. Thank you for the reply. However, since Gagauzia is not a breakaway state, nor is it a state, it is not a controversial topic or a topic at all, unlike for example Transnistria, South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Kosovo or Northern Cyprus, which are breakaway states and generate neverending controversy, disputes and edit wars. The problem as far as I understand is technical, for this one noncontroversial mistake anyway. Orattas (talk) 15:58, 29 January 2025 (UTC)
The problem is that there's been multiple reverts by multiple users on attempts to remove it. Adding me to the list would not solve what is still a dispute that can be solved by a discussion and a regular decision with more people than those already involved in the dispute. Even if it's not today a "breakaway state", this is still a region with special autonomous status, because of the 1994 conflict where it was declaring itself as a breakaway state, I have not followed the political development there, in what is already a very troubled region with military actions or wars. verdy_p (talk) 21:52, 29 January 2025 (UTC)
Thank you for the explanation. Orattas (talk) 08:06, 30 January 2025 (UTC)
Thanks you also, I'm not opposed to remove it, after you open a talk about it and there's a consensus. I just don't want to participate to an edit war, so I won't remove it without this consensus. verdy_p (talk) 11:00, 30 January 2025 (UTC)
Actually, a section in Module talk:Countries/Europe about Gagauzia was opened by User:Blackcat, to whom I did send a request about removing it. He removed it in Module:Countries/Europe, but was reverted by User:Reinhard Müller for technical reasons. Orattas (talk) 13:36, 30 January 2025 (UTC)
  •  Comment @Verdy p: , the problem is that it was a big original mistake to put Gagauzia in the template. Now it's too late for putting the blame on someone because of that, but geography is not a thing that goes by consensus, an atlas is enough. -- Blackcat 18:06, 30 January 2025 (UTC)

Greek alphabetic order

You totally mess Greek alphabetic order in Template:2letterNav200, it goes according to:

http://www.unicode.org/Public/UCA/latest/allkeys.txt *GREEK*LETTER* wildcard
Αα Ββ Γγ Δδ Εε Ϝϝ Ͷͷ Ϛϛ Ζζ Ͱͱ Ηη Θθ Ιι ℩ Ϳϳ Κκ Λλ Μμ Νν Ξξ Οο Ππ Ϻϻ Ϙϙ Ϟϟ Ρρ Σσ ς Ττ Υυ Φφ Χχ Ψψ Ωω Ͳͳ Ϡϡ Ϸϸ

103.171.245.170 07:15, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

Several PHP files are sorting = collating Greek letters in 1oo% WRONG way. This includes categories. See this:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgCategoryCollation

Whoever wrote these PHP files, botched category sorting = collating totally, at least in case of Greek letters. 49.156.44.114 15:40, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

The Template:2letterNav200 displays actually exactly the same order as what you list above! I don't understand your issue. There's nothing to change from an incorrect request made by an anonymous user (using two different IPs from a couple of VPN providers) that has never made any contribution in this wiki (except this message above). Nothing is messed, you seem to be confused. If there's a bug in PHP collation, this is not part of any page on this wiki, but part of PHP and must be reported to the PHP code maintainers.
Also note that MediaWiki does NOT use UCA collation for sorting members listed in any category; UCA collation is enabled only for the main namespace of some localized editions of Wiktionary, but this is the case nowhere on Commons; by default Mediawiki just uses binary order (by Unicode code point value, as encoded in UTF-8 that preserves that order) on the "sort keys" (specified in member pages when adding a category, or using the DEFAULTSORTKEY parser function if there's one, otherwise the page name itself). This has always been the case and requires tuning these sort keys (a frequent use case is to add a prefix like "*" to use alternate groupings). verdy_p (talk) 16:19, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
Utterly wrong order especially affecting ARCHAIC LETTERS, was ALREADY corrected by IPs. 49.156.44.114 16:50, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
Please be more polite and friendly. Note that these nav-templates have evolved over time to list more or less letters, as well they are not using any UCA collation at all, they just render lists (initially sorted in Unicode binary order, so the basic modern Greek alphabet was listed first and always visible, without needing to scroll the visible part, before all other archaic letters; collation order was just not intended in these lists). Do not assert things about people knowledge, I probably better know how UCA collation works (and I've been personally involved in the Unicode standardization process several decennials ago, when I was a Unicode member, to discuss and fix the UCA algorithm, including for Greek which is encoded since long). I am personally listed in the standard itself in its history and in the Unicode database. verdy_p (talk) 16:51, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
Sorry for being so plain. I propose you will exclude all letters having *GREEK*SYMBOL* wildcard in http://www.unicode.org/Public/UCA/latest/allkeys.txt or if not, include all missing *GREEK*SYMBOL* wildcard glyphs that are without diacritics. Correct sub-collation of archaic letters is this:
Ϝϝ Ͷͷ Ϛϛ Ͱͱ Ϳϳ Ϻϻ Ϙϙ Ϟϟ Ͳͳ Ϡϡ Ϸϸ
and earlier there was total collation mess. 49.156.44.114 16:59, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
Here again, there's no "Greek symbol" in the two lists above (and there's never been any one). These are plain Greek letters, even if they are historic/archaic (Greek symbols are additional variants of Greek letters used in maths notations, and in collation they sort the same as the associated letters, just after them with a minor tertiary difference, where as diacritics sort with a level-4 collation weight, an additional 5th level if for the binary order, used for distinct Unicode characters or sequences that are canonically equivalent.) None of the lists display letters with diacritics, remember these are jut nav-templates for base letter categories, that don't need to include all subcategories for variant symbols or letters with diacritics. Are you still thinking I don't know how UCA works? verdy_p (talk) 17:09, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
The *GREEK*SYMBOL* things previously added there by you are: GREEK CAPITAL KAI SYMBOL, GREEK CAPITAL LUNATE SIGMA SYMBOL. If you say that there's no "*GREEK*SYMBOL*" in the two lists above, why these both *GREEK*SYMBOL* characters are there, and long BEFORE any IP edits? 49.156.44.114 17:16, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
These two are used in plain Greek text as (abbreviated) ligatures of plain letters. They can be listed because they are not canonically equivalent to any other letters and were encoded completely distinctly, and are also found in Classical Greek dictionaries (even if they are used in these texts as symbols, just like the ampersand or arobase in Latin). Note that Commons does not focus any specific language or language version, it is international and independant of time, and there's no unique collation order for all languages or variants (the Unicode DUCET is just a basic good approximation that works most of the time as a common base for actual linguistic collation orders, with minimal tuning needed to build the latter ones by modifying the DUCET; if you consider the arobase, it is used both as a symbol and as a letter, usage varies depending on contexts and languages; don't focus too much on Unicode character names, they do not dictate any usage in actual languages, they are just commonly used "identifiers"). verdy_p (talk) 17:31, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
Now we have full DUCET *GREEK*LETTER* wildcard already covered. Formerly from categories were missing: Turned Greek Small Letter Iota, Greek Small Letter Final Sigma, both exist without uppercase equivalents. 49.156.44.114 10:25, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

Account

Why don't you use a user account on this wiki, instead of varying your IP depending on your current Internet connection? verdy_p (talk) 10:26, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

I simply still don't have account. I edit in hurry, but constructively, mostly from CURRENT IP ADDRESS. 49.156.44.114 10:29, 13 February 2025 (UTC)
Please create an account if you want to be involved in discussions. Otherwise don't be offended if they are ignored or not taken seriously, notably because of lack of reliable history over time, when your IP addresses may change without notice. It's also useful for your privacy. For such discussions, there's NO need to "edit in hurry" when the situation is stable and followed since long by many serious contributors. It just take a few seconds to create an account (protected by you own chosen password) and to also help protect your privacy. Without an account you cannot participate to many votes. and many contributors ignore requests made by users without account. verdy_p (talk) 10:36, 13 February 2025 (UTC)
I hesitate to create account because I don't want to reveal my first name and last name in account's name itself like you do at least partially. I am not sure how to name account in sensible way - lack of good ideas. 49.156.44.114 10:41, 13 February 2025 (UTC)
You don't need to use a real name, any pseudonym is fine. Your real name is part of private data, Wikimedia protects it. You choose what to publish (but your IP can reveal your identity to any one, including many companies, that track you on many websites you visit at the same time and correlate this info very easily). If you register an email address on Wikimedia for your account, it will also be protected and hidden, it will just be used to recover your account in case of problem or very strictly by Wikimedia officers that are required to follow the privacy guidelines made and enforced by the community and by an official site charter protected by laws. Your IP does not protect you as much (and if you try to use a IP shared by many users, for example an exit node from a VPN provider, you may be blocked at any time if any other random user uses the same IP, but you won't be blocked if you use your personal account to logon. Additionally you'll get access to other tools and user preferences that cannot be used by unauthenticated users. verdy_p (talk) 10:49, 13 February 2025 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) Philippe, you might want to check this. -- Tuválkin 17:33, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
That's a new user, still misinformed. I tolerate these because he wants explainations. There's no "stalking" for now, I think. He may be more helpful in the future, give him a chance. However I don't know if he does the same thing on other's talk pages. verdy_p (talk) 17:43, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
Seeing such THORGAL NAME CALLING i decide NOT to create account. NEVER! 115.178.49.101 19:45, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
I wanted to help you, to get used with how the community interacts and cooperate, sorry you take this so bad and so personally (and I don't understand your strong words "THORGAL NAME CALLING", there was nothing personal and no attack at all). If you still want to use an IP, that's fine, as long you you respect the community rules (you can look at Commons:Community portal, but there are many pages where people can discuss and interact, and get helped if you're new to the project. I suggest looking for at such portal pages, to see how things are done, progressively and patiently. There's no emergency to edit pages just because you think it looks better for you: The projects are very large, and are managed globally to get some coherence. But it's normal at the beginning to get lost, as there are lot to learn, and you should be acting more modestly, with small trials and be aware that nothing is definitive but it is a result of a long patient effort, with many people performing searches, checking sources, fixing small things. Be careful however if you want t change something made by others, especially when the history shows that this has been stable and used since many years. Efforts Wikimedia Commons are endless and coordinated between many users and contributors. That's the first time I see a newcomer not wanting to try joining the community. May be you've not understood the goals and that you overreact. Have a good day. verdy_p (talk) 20:10, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
It is NOT you Verdy, from whom I expect help and defense against such slanders, it is some TUBAL CAIN who tramples upon my dignity. How he dares to name call upon me by some BREIVIK-alikes upon me by inline links? These all scandinavian name callings, it is what shows that w:en:WP:CIVIL is far away from this TUBAL CAIN. 115.178.49.101 20:42, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
I don't know what you've have done with other accounts or IPs. But if you have violated community rules while using them, and attempt to circumvent these rules by using anonymizing VPNs or other tricks, you can be blocked from editing on this wiki. I have no proof (and you give no link to show where you've been attacked and by whom), but some admins have tools to identify you even if you use temporary random IPs and eventually block you for more or less time. And this may extend across all Wikimedia wikis, and permanently if you insist doing so. Using an IP will NOT protect you to do everything you want. You've been warned. Be careful, there's a community, you're not alone and not allowed to do everything you want without discussion. If you think you've been personnaly attacked, you can complain properly (once again there are Community help pages to contact independent and trusted moderators that will listen the arguments and verify the assertions made). verdy_p (talk) 20:54, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
I only can tell you that I edit from behind GREAT CHINA FIREWALL. Attack link was thrown here by TUBAL CAIN in this discussion. I have done nothing wrong with these other IP-s. But seeing warning even from you, I think it is somewhat preemptive since I never wanted to vandalize here. All I done recently, was done CONSTRUCTIVELY. Nonetheless, feeling heavy atmosphere here, I ask you do you know some more lenient NON-WMF WIKI farm? 115.178.49.101 20:59, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
STOP! You're now spamming this page, and want to separate this subthread when I replied to you. Also I know that you've lied about your location, and now you continue sending harassing words about users. I won't reply to you now. Tuválkin was right, given his proofs given in the link he sent above (that I did not notice initially). Don't edit my messages or messages sent by others. verdy_p (talk) 07:30, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
Insults in your edits are unacceptable. I've been very polite. verdy_p (talk) 08:21, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
I should have NOT reply, but calling me a liar too is insult, see: w:zh:Special:Contribs/115.178.49.101 i am from CHINA. 115.178.49.101 08:28, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
I have reported you to the long complaint list. You've been blocked from multiple wikis after insulting many users and lying there too. STOP. I do not authorize you to edit my talk page. verdy_p (talk) 08:30, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
Special:Contributions/Future_Perfect_at_Sunrise PURE VANDALISM - ADMONISH HIM PLEASE! 103.199.139.1 11:41, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
This is a pure sockpuppet of yourself (already reported and detected by others). Stop this. I do not authorize you to edit this page in a fake attempt to hide your actions. This talk page is monitored and admins are handling this from my reports and reports made by other trusted users. I repeat again: I don't want ANY further post in this topic by IP users like you. This talk page is not the appropriate place. I cannot trust such IPs (randomly selected from harvested open proxies from small ISPs or sites in Indonesia, India, or elsewhere) and have no tool to check them or to handle such requests (and made in such way with allcaps orders!). verdy_p (talk) 11:46, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
If you do not believe ME, please believe at least quality of my edits! This FUT PERF ruins everything, he reintroduces RED LINKS to templates, he omits some categories from being linked to templates, he vanishes category of lower grade from category of higher grade, etc. 61.91.202.210 11:58, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
Using open proxies found with tools (or in various lists on the blacknet) without prior authorization of the host/site owner is a network abuse (stolen access rights) and forbidden by laws in many countries. I have already ordered you to stop your posts here multiple times. Using new random IPs and insisting is harassment. In addition you are now attacking trusted English Wikipedia admins, and trusted licence verifiers. Don't blame them in their honest attempt to revert the nightmare you are causing. verdy_p (talk) 12:01, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
This is completely unjustifiable John was OK, and article was correctly translated from italian wikipedia. Defacing of improved pages by BLIND ROLLBACK is even worse. I can and will give you respite and nice treatment, even silence if you want, even some compromise article version if you will know me how, but this rollbacker should NOT go out freely. He did many wrongs crosswiki. He even got some ban on meta for his totalitarian attitude. 193.47.189.33 12:29, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
I again reverted him according to YOUR reverts of him. Your report did more bad than good. Now this FUT PERF can by BLIND ROLLBACKS ruin everything, since you only would progressively correct me. Tell him something to have him stop. 103.155.168.88 17:53, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
Again, don't do anything. And gain stop posting here. You are blocked globally, do not circumvent this block. We don't need your "help" just to add confusion ! "FPS" is probably undoing all you did before. verdy_p (talk) 18:02, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
At least you, please do some improving edits over mine edits, so FUT PERF will stop his FUT PERF revenge for sake of revenge. I cannot bear such WRONG behavior 100X worse than mine. Remember FPS has short former bans on META in log. 103.155.168.88 18:09, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
Nothing in common with all what you did repeatedly; this was just a short break and a solution was found. But none for you. You continue ignoring the global ban. Don't write me here and don't send any orders! The classification of letters is an old work in progress, there's no emergency at all! STOP. verdy_p (talk) 18:13, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

Weather and climate

Category discussion warning

Weather and climate has been listed at Commons:Categories for discussion so that the community can discuss ways in which it should be changed. We would appreciate it if you could go to voice your opinion about this at its entry.

If you created this category, please note that the fact that it has been proposed for discussion does not necessarily mean that we do not value your kind contribution. It simply means that one person believes that there is some specific problem with it. If the category is up for deletion because it has been superseded, consider the notion that although the category may be deleted, your hard work (which we all greatly appreciate) lives on in the new category.

In all cases, please do not take the category discussion personally. It is never intended as such. Thank you!


Sbb1413 (he) (talkcontribsuploads) 07:14, 5 February 2025 (UTC)